AP* Retreat / APNG joint meeting
29 August 2002 (afternoon) - 30 August 2002 (noon)

Location: Shanghai, China

Participants: Champika Wijayatunga (APNIC) , BK Kim (AP Outreach), Hirofumi HOTTA (APIA),
Hewu Li (CERNET) , Izumi AIZU (ANR), Jun Murai (JPNIC), Jeonghye Choi (IAK),
Jie An (CERNET),Kyoko Day ( APIA) , Maria Ng ( IDRC) , Opart Panyachairucksa,
(THNIC) , Norbert Kleen (Open Forum of Comboida) , Paul Wilson (APNIC) , Pensri A
(APJS) , Prof. Kilnam Chon (KAIST),Prof. Xing Li (APNG), Prof. Shigeki Goto (APNG) ,
Prof. Suguru Yamaguchi (WIDE) Toru Takahashi (RIIS) ,Tommy Matsumoto (JPNIC),
Tomomistu Baba ( AI3 Project) Yue Li (CERNET), Yan Ma (BUPT), Anthony Lee (TWNIC),
Jianping Wu , Sun-young Yang (Yang-Yang)

Meeting started at 8:30am (local time)

The meeting discussed following topics:
The meeting was chaired by Jun Murai. The chair asked the participants to review the agenda.
The minutes follow the sequence of the revised meeting agenda.

1. Report on AP* organizations' activities - Topic chaired by Jun Murai

1.1 APNG Camp
Report presented by Yang-Yang, chair of the 2nd APNG CAMP

The 2nd APNG Camp was held on 28-29 August 2002.

The APNG camp is the place for Internet leaders of next generation and it is the platform where
seniors and next generation can work, share and learn together. The APNG camp is intends to
foster multidisciplinary research including engineering but also non-engineering. In the second
APNG camp, the meaning of Asia Youth Network, the possibilities of Internet Leadership in AP,
the problem of digital divide in AP and the development of feminism & technology were discussed
by participants.
There were 61 participants: 2 au, 1 kh, 16 cn, 10 jp, 1 us, 1 hk, 18 kr, 2 my, 1 sg, 2 tw and 7 th
and 9 remote participants from Tokyo, Soul and Thailand.
Three working groups were formed. Feminism working group, Internet policy working group and
Asia youth culture working group.

Next meeting:
- The 3rd APNG Camp will be held in Taipei, Taiwan during APRICOT2003 at 20-21 Feb 2003
- The main Theme is 'The new relationships on the net'
- Working group & BOF on digital divide, civil society, playing music and drama should be added.
- Contact person is Anthony Lee from TWNIC

Consensus:
- The AP* organization will help support the APNG camp activity. For example, activities inside the
camp could be directly connecting to the existing AP activities, i.e., APAN and APRICOT.
- Need the structure to encourage young people to discuss and solve the problem among themselves.
Senior will support when the next generation asks.
- Funding and secretariat help are needed.

1.2 APJS
Report presented by B.K.Kim, Co-Executive Director APJS
APJS needs a legal body to handle the payment for ccTLD secretariat staff.
- 'Asia Pacific Joint Secretariat, Ltd.' has already been registered as a one dollar company in
British Virgin Island since 31st May 2002.
- The process of opening the bank account in British Virgin Island will finish in September 2002.
- The company has 2 directors, BK Kim and Pensri A.

There will be three categories of membership:
- voting organization: members are AP* organization
- non voting organization
- non-voting individual

Current activities of APJS are
- AP* retreat
- apstar.org homepage (calendar and other information)
- ccTLD secretariat
- APoutreach

Schedule of APJS
- Sep - Oct 2002:
· Finish Incorporation process
· Finish bylaws and membership structure
· Getting membership fee
· Bidding for APRICOT secretariat
- Nov - Dec 2002: voting for the new board members
- Feb 2003: APJS member and board meeting in Taipei during APRICOT2003

Activities of APoutreach:APoutreach had two BOF during APRICOT2002 and two seminars in
India during April 2002. APoutreach will organize two ccTLD name server workshops during
September 2002, one in Vietnam and the other one in Bangladesh. There will also be a ccTLD
name server workshop in Shanghai during ICANN meeting in October 2002. The funding of
APoutreach for FY2002 came from APNIC.

Conclusion:
Jun Murai proposed that APJS might be able to provide secretariat support to APNG camp.

1.3 APRICOT
Report presented by Paul Wilson and Kyoko Day
The APRICOT executive committee has already made a decision in July to accept the proposal
from APIA to merge the APIA and APRICOT. APIA will provide a legal umbrella to APRICOT.
The APRICOT2003 will be held in Taipei during 24-28 Feb 2003.

1.4 APIA
Report presented by Kyoko Day

The economic crisis forced the APIA to change its strategies and restructuring the organization.
At the end of Jan 2002, the chair person of APIA has been changed from Hiro Hotta to Toru Takahashi
and the secretariat has been relocated to Japan since Feb 2002.

Currently, APIA has 2 large, 4 small, 2 LDC/NPO and 9 individual members, Restructuring funding
scheme and new sources of funding are critical to survive.

Activities of the APIA during the year 2002 are
- Endorsed APRICOT2002 as a gold sponsor
- Published newsletter#7/#8 and e-Update
- Coordination effort has been made with AP* organizations
- Organized the Annual General Meeting at APRICOT2002 where APIA submitted the proposal
to APRICOT.
- Had the Forums at APRICOT2002 for Internet Industry Country report and IX panel discussion
- Continued the IX activities by having an additional meeting at IETF in Yokohama and planned for
a workshop with AP Outreach program but the major problem is seeking the source of funding.
- Organized IX Operators Forum and APIA & APRICOT joint meetings during IETF in Yokohama

APIA and APRICOT reached the consensus in Yokohama in July 2002 to merge two bodies and to
fill the APIA Board with the stakeholders from APRICOT. The new board members are Abhisak Chulya,
Yong Wan Ju, James Seng, and Philip Smith. The selection was based on the recommendation by APIA
and APRICOT stakeholders, past proven record, commitment to AP* organizations, and their country
representations. The new APIA board will lead the way to move forward.

The next meeting will be in Kokura in September 2002. The new officers will be appointed.

APIA plans to continue the collaboration with other organizations and individual experts.
The formal Election has been planned to be at the next AGM in Taipei during APRICOT2003.

1.5 APAN
Report presented by Kilnam Chon
The major undertaken is to have three clusters: North East Asia Cluster (JP, KR, CN,…) ,
South East Asia Cluster (MY, SG, TH,…) and Oceanic Cluster (AU,…). The three clusters
will be fully linked to each other via high speed backbone. This may take 2-3 years.

1.6 APTLD
Report presented by B.K.Kim
APTLD next meeting will be held in Malaysia on 14-15 Sept 2002. The main topics of this meeting
are ICANN reform and ccSO. AP GAC members have been invited to this APTLD meeting.

Discussion:
Europe cctld (CENTR) is dominating the ccTLD. To counter balance the CENTR, APTLD has to
1. be incorporated as soon as possible
2. get more members. Currently APTLD has 10-15 members while the countries in Asia Pacific are
about 60-70. To represent Asia Pacific, APTLD needs more members.

1.7 MINC
Report presented by Shigeki Goto

The current Board of MINC decided to hold elections in September 2002 to replace 6 MINC board
members retiring in September 2002.

The schedule of the elections is as followed:
Aug 11th, 2002: Call for nominations
Sep10th, 2002: Announcement of candidates
Sep 11th, 2002: Voting starts
Sep 25th, 2002: Election Procedure complete.
Sep 29th, 2002: Successful candidates certified
Sep 30th, 2002: Inauguration of the board at the JDNA-MINC Joint Meeting in Tokyo.
(JDNA - Japan Domain Names Association)

The following topics will be presented at the JDNA/MINC Joint workshop:
- A historical background, current activities and issues of Internationalized Domain Names by Prof. Tan Tin Wee
- The activities of the ICANN IDN committee
- The technical overview of IDN, relating RFC
- The situation of Japanese JP Domain Names

1.8 APNIC
Report presented by Paul Wilson

The requests for the address space are getting slower than the last year anyway the growth of the
address space in Asia Pacific is more aggressive than in the US and Europe.

APNIC has organizing the training twice a month. The main focuses of the trainings are on the IP
address and IP address related topics. APNIC is preparing a proposal to request for the funding
to increase the training activities to other topics because APNIC cannot spend APNIC membership
fee for others activity which do not benefit to its members.

The APNIC is providing the member services helpdesk. The Helpdesk gives APNIC members and
clients direct access to APNIC hostmaster to resolve all inquiries . Members and clients can call,
fax or email to the helpdesk. Currently, there are 10 helpdesk languages. More language will be added in the future.

Due to the ICANN reform process, the RIRs decided to postpone the contract signing with the ICANN.

Next APNIC Open Policy meeting will be in Kokura, Japan on 3-6 September 20002.

Discussion:
China will have Internet users more than in USA within 2005 and India will have more Internet users in 2010 but they cannot get class A (IPv4) while many companies in USA have one class A for one company. RIRs or ICANN should look into this problem else government of those countries or the ITU will come to involve. APNIC should come up with a position paper about this.

1.9 APatlarge
Report presented by Izumi Aizu

There is a proposal of the Atlarge advisory committee (ALAC) proposed by the
assistant group to the ALSC.

Instead of the board member, the proposal proposed to send one liaison person from
this advisory committee to the board of ICANN.

The advisory committee is regional based organization, 5 regional organizations according
to ICANN 5 regions. Each regional organization will have its own council. Each regional
organization sends (either by selection or election) two members to the advisory committee.
The board will recommend 5 members of the committee. The advisory committee has 15 members.
The advisory committee will send one liaison person to each SO.

Atlarge structure is self-forming and individual self supporting but accredit by ICANN. Criteria are
needed to be setup so they will be recognized by ICANN to participate the Atlarge organization.

The proposal also proposed to review after one year whether it goes better or well then may be
this advisory committee will send a voting member to the board but it depends on the actual achievement.

The ICANN board meeting will decide in October, Shanghai meeting.

1.10 APSIRC/APCERTF
Report presented by Suguru Yamaguchi
Asia Pacific Security Incident Response Coordination (APSIRC) was started in 1998 as a
security working group under APNG. At that moment the working group gathered information
about the other active groups in AP and kept the contacts for communicate among CSIRT
(Computer Security Incident Response Team). The communication was done via email. The
businesses of APSIRC are gathering information about the security incident and technology
related to the security incident and redistribute them to the public mainly the company and
the Internet users.

APSIRC held its first physical meeting on March 24-26, 2002 in Tokyo, Japan. Almost all
of the CSIRT (17-18 CSIRTs in 11 countries) in the AP region participated in this meeting.
APNIC has been invited to the meeting. The new task force has been kicked off named
APCERTF (Asia Pacific Computer Emergency Response Task Force). APSIRC is the open
regional forum of the CSIRTs and related groups. APCERTF has 5 countries members,
Australia, Hong Kong, Japan, Korea and China. The charter of the task force is developing .
APCERTF is making the awareness program to make ourselves as the first contact point of
Asia Pacific in term of security. APCERTF will also deal with the government to make the
better situation of the security in term of the security management.

APSIRC next meeting will be held in 2003 somewhere in AP. The members of the APCERTF
want to have the recognition from the government. APCERTF sent some delegates to the latest
APEC Tel working group in September 2003 and setup a security sub-working group under the
Tel workgroup. APCERTF will try to contact ASEM cyber security working group.

APSIRC's URL: www.jpcert.or.jp/apsirc/

2. Local Internet Community -- chaired by Izumi Aizu
Community networking has quite long history. In US and Canada, community networking
has been strong since early '80s. Starting from Freenet and Fidonet, BBS had been used to
exchange their information among local people as well as the outside. Santa Monica and
Seattle were very famous.

In Japan, very strong group of PC networking had been created since mid '80s. It concerned
on economic development.

In Europe, it was started to pick up in '90s with strong citizen tradition.

BBS was switched to Internet in early to mid of '90s. The community networking almost died
because with Internet connectivity we can get a lot of information from outside.

It was come back again in Asia with the E-government by local governments.

The community networking activities was started with local BBS and the Community Access
Center/Telecenter was setup by IDRC, UNDP, etc, … in many developing countries as the
first step to help local people get access to the Internet to get information.

Citizen participation to governance (e-Democracy): There is a web site that supports mainly
US people. The participants can go to the parliament or the global council and others activity.
It is part of the applications of the community network.

In Chicago, Palo Alto and several Canadian cities are allowed to employ fiber by themselves.
Universities, schools and hospitals share this fiber.

In Stockholm, the municipal governments established the dark fiber company called Stokab to
provide the service to the people in the city. In Milan, they are setting up a company similar to
the Stokab. Similar thing is happening in Ireland and China.

The other activity of the community network is economic development likes tourism
promotion, training and websites.

There are several conferences, for example, GlobalCN (Global Community Network).
The international coalition known as GlobalCN was founded in Barcelona in November 2000. The url is www.globalcn.org.

The other conference is the American National Community Network Conference. The fifth
National Community Network Conference will be held in Austin, Texas on December 8-10 2002. AFCN and US are the main sponsors.

Discussion:
Local Internet Community has been proposed to be an item for the next meeting because only
community networking had been discussed in this meeting. Local Internet Community is a very
importance. The Internet is now changed. AP* should have a composition. AP* now is AP*
of engineering. We should have AP* of social science.

3. Spam issue -- by Kilnam Chon
There was an article, which stated that most of the spammers send the English spam messages
through open relay servers in Asia like Korea, China and Taiwan.

Non-English spam mails were also sent outside their countries, for example, Korean spam mail
have been sent to outside Korea which it doesn't make sense.

Spam mail is now about 35% of the total email and increasing.

We need to get the international collaboration among countries. We have to start APCAUCE
(The Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial Email) like in Europe, Canada and Australia.

Currently, we don't have any good governance in AP except in Australia. We should have
good governance structure at least among ISPs, portals, and user organizations.

During ICANN next meeting in Shanghai in October, ccTLD may organize a meeting to
find out a way to solve the problem internationally. At least we can discuss on the good and bad laws.

There will be a Network Abuse BOF at the next APNIC open policy meeting in Kyushu,
Japan, 3-6 September 2002. RIPECC is going to have its BOF in September and probably ARIN will have a BOF.

There should have a global meeting that USA (spam generator) and AP (spam relay) can work together.

Conclusion:
- BOF in APNIC next meeting
- A meeting during Shanghai ICANN meeting
- APIA may help to set up the APCAUCE

4. Backbone networks in Asia -- by Shigeki Goto

"Asia Broadband Backbone" -- by Shigeki Goto

APAN Backbone committee was formed. The Backbone committee will coordinate
the creation of the ASIA backbone. The position paper is to help to explain to the funding bodies in the different country.

The charter of the committee is to create the position paper for the ASIA backbone
to address the following issues:
1. Link to USA. There are a number of links to the USA presently. Could they be aggregated?
2. TEIN connection to ASIA. There might be another possibility for overland connection to Europe.
3. North East Asia Cluster, South East Asia Cluster and Oceania Cluster: There should be
multiple hops that people could connect to in the region.
4. These clusters should be fully connected. <-IEEAF
5. Link speed among clusters should be higher than the inter-continental links.
Link speed inside a cluster is equal or higher than the speed among clusters.
The backbone has the open policy for Research and Education community.

For those topics, Markus (AU) will work on the USA link, Ettikan (MY) will work on the TEIN
connection to Asia, Francis (SG) will work on the cluster and D.Y. Kim (KR) will work on the IEEAF.

Potential sponsor is Japanese government that will support some part of the three clusters.
Asia Broadband Backbone Committees was formed in Japan. The committee discussed on how
the Japanese government will play the key roles for IT deployments in Asia, but should be widely
collaborated by
- Joint planning with leaders in other countries
- Wide range participants including government, private sectors and NPOs
- Advanced Experiments & Education
- Expanding Intra-regional communication
Two sub committees were setup. Strategic Committee will design the guideline, chair by Jiro Ushio,
and Planning Committee will make the plan based on the guideline from the Strategic Committee, chair by Shigeki Goto.

5. ISOC -- by Anthony Lee
Last December, the Internet society made several changes in the governance structure.
Now all chapters can nominate and vote for board sates. It is a good chance for chapters to participate more actively.

In last election there was no candidate from ASIA so we miss the chance to have
voice from Asia.We need to make assure that we can have participation from Asia
Chapters have to focus on local Internet issues.

There is no active chapter in Asia. As to be active in Asia we need to have AP ISOC
chapter to discuss the local issue. We need to consider more chapters from underdeveloped countries.

We should organized ISOC countries chapter meeting in Taipei during APRICOT2003.

6. Liaison with other AP bodies -- Topic chaired by Paul Wilson
Liaison is the importance topic because AP* organization is a liaison body, a body which
represent the network among AP* groups.

Liaison is a synonym for networking and cooperation. Liaison involves with the information
exchange, collaborate projects, resource pooling and mutual support.

AP* secretariat has been helping with the liaison among AP* organizations. We need more
about liaison between AP* organizations and others organization outside the AP* cluster and
a liaison between the umbrella of the AP* group itself and the others collaborative group like
us that exist in the world.

APNIC is one of the three RIRs. APNIC collaborates and cooperates closely with the
other RIRs. There are cooperative projects among RIRs and share resource in term of
staff and representation at the meetings. The specific collaborative group between RISs is
ASO under ICANN. APNIC also has an informal liaison relationship with the GAC via
information sharing.

APNIC exchanges information with other AP organizations and also provides the support
to the PAN of IDRC's ICT R&D grants program.

6.1.Pan Asia Networking (PAN) under IDRC - by Maria Ng
IDRC's Public corporation created by the Parliament of Canada in 1975 to help researchers
and communities in the developing world find solutions to their social, economic & environmental problems.

The Information Communication Technologies for Development (ICT4D) is a program of IDRC.
PAN is a regional program under ICT4D program.

Two objectives among strategic objectives of PAN that might be of interest of the APNG group are:
- To encourage the advanced-technology countries in Asia to engage in capacity-building and in the
coaching of slower adopting countries, through the promotion of research collaboration and networking
- To network digital pioneers in the region and foster broad research partnerships for sharing and
learning from each other and for articulating regional concerns at international fora.

PAN is looking for collaborative work that a) interests other donor ICT investors in the region to
collaborate and b) facilitates regional ICT groups to be involved in ICT work in developing countries.

PAN has been working with many organizations on ICT programs/projects, for example
International Foundation for Agricultural Development (IFAD), APDIP, APNIC, Rockefeller
Foundation, ASEAN foundation and ADB.

There will be a PAN all partners conference at Vientiane in 2003. PAN would like to invite
AP* to attend this meeting to help contribute to the PAN by a) Integrating a plenary and/or
training programme on Internet governance issues. b) thinking about the prospect of a future
PAN-All Partners Conference combined with APNG Conference that could equate to a regular
Asian ICT Conference, with majority Asian participation, an Asia agenda that is also meaningful
to Asia's least developing countries, and attended by them as well.

6.2 WIDE project - by Jun Murai
WIDE is a domestic research body running in Japan. WIDE has many liaison relationships with
other organizations all over the world. The liaison with APAN groups is very helpful for WIDE
in getting the status report from those groups or sharing the results.

Conclusion:
We should invite more outside organization to participate in AP* Retreat.

7. Strategic plans for working with University and Research Institute -- by Jun Murai
Researchers, training, human resource by Jun Murai

Future networking environment depends very much on AP directions. Many advanced
researches have been done within AP region on advanced networking technologies.
We have a responsibility to take a lead in creating the advanced research environment.

Human resources and training/education are not well coordinated in the region comparing
with the other regions. We need training/education to promote/share the researches/results
to others organization in the region.

We would need the advanced science researches who uses the AP network infrastructure
and we need training to startup the network technologies.

We should have a better scholarship model to make the money be used effectively. The
model that has been tested and works well has the following steps: 1) prepare the distance
education, then 2) identify the student 3) student identify the professor 4) giving the scholarship
according to the result of steps 1-3

We do have peer-to-peer relationships on advanced networking going on in the region. We still
need to find ways to employ those activities and also to share or outreach the result of the advanced
networking and contribute to the global as a region.

We should have funding actions as the region like APAN is dealing with NSF and EU to create the
global funding model. We need to continue in the other AP* activities the similar thing or share the
effort. Asia broadband backbone is going on. We should provide the proposal to get the funding from them.

Distance education/training/human resources on advanced and developing should also be considered.

7.1 International Collaboration Among research institutions - by Yan Ma

In China there are there IPv6 Academic Test-beds which doing research on essential
technologies for technical orientation. The objectives for next-phase academic test-bed
are strengthening infrastructure network technology R&D and do the international collaboration.

In BUPT, one of the CERNET members university, lots of cooperation has been established
with WIDE, Nokia and other counter parts.

CJ-IPv6 joint project has been supported by Chinese and Japanese governments to do the
test-bed on IPv6.

A collaboration proposal has been submitted and approved in APEC TEL meeting for
the E-University project. The proposal was submitted by Pacific Neighborhood Consortium (PNC), ITU and APEC TEL.

7.2 AI3 project - by Jun Murai
AI3 has the transponder to cover the entire areas of AP. The UDL technology has been
invented and implemented by AI3. Using this technology, IPv6 multicast over satellite
UDLR has been provided. We are leading the world with this technology. Laos and
Myanmar had never been connected but has been connected.

We do provide global classes under SOI (School of Internet). SOI has remote site
in Japan and remote sites in the US (San Diego, Los Angels, Florida, etc). There
were 2 courses all done by remote lectures from Maryland to Japan. There are
three SOI global studios. One in KEIO University at SFC, one in Maryland and
the other one in Palo Alto, CA. This is a proof of the technology.

SOI is organizing SOI-Asia Operators Workshop in KEIO University, Japan
during Aug 28 - Sept 4, 2002. We gather 21 technical staffs from SOI Asia
partners and have 5 days training program in Basic Networking and Unix Operation
. The objectives of the workshop are to stable and autonomous operation in each site
, have collaboration among partners and having a standard training program for future sites.

We have been working from the research & development to providing the good
environment for the science researches and then developing the real commercia
l infrastructure. We should consider to work in different model: start from the R&D
to the Internet development and then to the commercial which US and EU/Africa
have been working on but AP has less activities.

8. Possibly merging of APIA/APRICOT -- Topic chaired by Kilnam Chon
Conclusions:
- The program committee chair of the APRICOT should be an office holder in executive
committee. Need active program committee members from AP region.
- APnog of Asia should be a track in APRICOT and APNIC.
- The conference should be organized 2 times a year (one in February and the other
one in November with APNIC).
- Education training will be a track in APRICOT starting from APRICOT2003 in Taipei.
- APIA and APRICOT has been merged. APIA will take care of the secretariat/event secretariat for APRICOT.
- APRICOT will be as for surplus operated organization.

9. Possibly merging/coordination of apng and ap* -- Topic chaired by Kilnam Chon
Conclusions:
- APNG will focus on the APNG camp. APNG camp should be organized more than
once a year. The main issue is funding which we need to work out. APJS can help on
secretariat work.
- AP* should include non-engineering organizations. We should try to invite these
organizations to come to the next AP* retreat meeting.
- Outreach should be done to educate the people in government/policy planning group.
This topic should be visited again in the next meeting.
- AP* retreat next meeting will be held in Taipei in conjunction with APRICOT2003
during Feb 22nd (9:00am) - 23rd (12am), 2002. VDO conferencing should be prepared
so that participants who cannot go to the meeting can remotely participate. The co-chairs
are Vincent Chen from TWNIC and Tommy Matsumoto from JPNIC.

The meeting ended at 1.30pm (local time)